Comments for More or Less Bunk

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by Jonathan Rees

Jonathan Rees — Sat, 18 May 2013 01:44:26 +0000

Sciences? Hello!!! Labs?

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by CIP

CIP — Sat, 18 May 2013 01:40:03 +0000

@Mark Peterson

Some subjects, especially in the sciences, lend themselves to the MOOC. There, instant feedback on problem solving is more important than discussion. I have my doubts that ther MOOC model translates very well to history, literature or several other subjects. On the other hand, it may be better than 500 students in a lecture hall listening to some guy.

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by Mark Peterson

Mark Peterson — Fri, 17 May 2013 22:23:21 +0000

We have always had that “power,” well — since the invention of the printing press. One of the great mysteries of all this is how MOOCs are supposed to be better than, well, books. If I want to know what Michael Sandel thinks about Justice, shouldn’t I read his books on the subject, which come with footnotes and bibliographies, i.e.. the evidence of how and why he came to his views, rather than his canned lectures on the subject, which presumably don’t? What real classroom teaching, as opposed to canned lectures, does is to show students how to take material not from just one expert, but from lots of different ones, and assemble it into something more, and more flexible, and arguably better, than what any single professor, no matter how famous and spectacular, can do just by lecturing. I have taught the first half of the US History survey at least, I don’t know, fifteen times in my career, and each time I assign different readings, different writing assignments, my lectures change, the sections and their topics change, because the point of actual “courses” is for everyone, teacher(s) and students, to think through the material together so that they learn how to think about it, now and in the future.
Honestly, we need to think hard about what education is, and why people want it, not about the lowest price and most convenient way we can get something that sort of resembles it. That’s how we got “fast food.”

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by CIP

CIP — Fri, 17 May 2013 15:39:47 +0000

@Jonathan Rees

If you would cool your jets for a moment, I’m talking about the opportunity to learn. I’ve found that I can learn just fine in front of my computer. I can’t attend classes in far away universities that are scheduled for the convenience of professors with an afternoon tee time.

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by CIP

CIP — Fri, 17 May 2013 15:31:11 +0000

@Historiann,

Physicians may have a stronger union, but they are also seeing the effect of what is really a robot driven revolution. Computers have shown that they can read EKGs better than cardiologists. Soon most diagnostic work will be done by computer.

It’s very much research and scholarship that I’m worried about in the current educational revolution. I have about forty years experience in research, some of it in an academic setting, so I’m not quite the naif you imagine.

The reason I comment here is because I think that the kind of angry reactionary rhetoric Professor Rees favors is counterproductive. I certainly don’t blame him for being angry – anybody seeing his way of life threatened would be. Perhaps I’m wrong, and the protests of a few humanities types will persuade enough of their colleagues to resist the enormous technological and financial pressures driving the MOOC revolution, but I wouldn’t count on it.

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by The dream of the 90s! : Historiann : History and sexual politics, 1492 to the present

Fri, 17 May 2013 14:07:20 +0000

[…] ideas. Play nice, and definitely let’s keep the conversation going in the previous post. Jonathan Rees of More or Less Bunk has responded to Susan Amussen and Allyson Poska’s post, among other recent MOOC critiques, so stop by his […]

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by Historiann

Historiann — Fri, 17 May 2013 14:04:21 +0000

A-hahaha! Of course, David, it’s only teachers and proffies we expect to defer to the demands of the market. Just imagine a world in which physicians are instructed by their patients which treatments and therapies they’ll be delivering, or lawyers whose only function is effectively to permit the foolish client to represent himself. Because let us not forget, these physicians and attorneys are paid to serve their clients.

CIP doesn’t have a clue about the difference between universities and community colleges or high schools. Ze doesn’t understand (or has contempt for) the fact that proffies at 4-year universities aren’t just teachers, but also researchers and administrators. Ze doesn’t care that universities aren’t just places where people can take classes, but also generators of new knowledge. Unfortunately, the decision of 4-year universities and prominent R1s now to compete with Kaplan, Phoenix, and the community college down the road has contributed mightily to the confusion on display in CIP’s comments.

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by A shift in the MOOCmentum: coverage of and conversations around our open letter to Michael Sandel (part 3). | Adventures in Ethics and Science

Fri, 17 May 2013 03:10:20 +0000

[…] read the whole thing to see some of the sensible options for avoiding a beak full of […]

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by Jonathan Rees

Jonathan Rees — Fri, 17 May 2013 00:48:27 +0000

Of course, because we all know that the ability to learn at home in your pajamas is much more important than whether you actually learn anything.

Comment on “Would you like to shoot me now or wait ’til you get home?” by Jonathan Rees

Jonathan Rees — Fri, 17 May 2013 00:25:16 +0000

Thanks sophylou! Post now corrected.